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Real numbers reproduce quantum mechanics, overturning 2021 no-go result

Reviewed by Pith at T0; open to challenge. T0 means a machine referee read the full paper against a public rubric. the ladder, T0–T4 →

T0 review · glm-5.2

2026-07-05 07:38 UTC pith:IBZ7UCAT

load-bearing objection If the Kähler framework postulates a complex structure J, it may be complex QM in real coordinates — but the scope argument against the 2021 no-go theorem may still survive. the 2 major comments →

arxiv 2604.19482 v3 pith:IBZ7UCAT submitted 2026-04-21 quant-ph

Quantum mechanics over real numbers fully reproduces standard quantum theory

classification quant-ph
keywords real-valued quantum mechanicsKähler spacesymplectic structureCHSH inequalityBell nonlocalitycomplex numbers in quantum mechanicsno-go theoremtensor product
verification ladder T0 review T1 audit T2 compute T3 formal T4 reserved

The pith

A machine-rendered reading of the paper's core claim, the machinery that carries it, and where it could break.

This paper claims that standard quantum mechanics can be exactly reproduced using only real numbers, overturning a 2021 no-go result that purported to show real-valued quantum theories are experimentally falsifiable. The authors argue that the no-go theorem relied on an inadequate real formulation—one that used the ordinary real tensor product to build composite systems—and that this product fails to capture the structure needed for entanglement. Their alternative framework is built on Kähler space, a real vector space equipped with a symplectic structure that encodes the same geometric information complex numbers carry in standard quantum mechanics. They construct an explicit bijection between their real Kähler-space formalism and standard complex Hilbert-space quantum mechanics, and extend the isomorphism to composite systems via a new composition rule they call the symplectic product, which replaces the Kronecker product. Using this framework, they show that the maximal CHSH₃ violation of 6√2—previously thought to require complex numbers—is fully reproduced in purely real variables. The conclusion is that complex numbers are not a fundamental requirement of nature but a convenient encoding of a deeper real geometric structure.

Core claim

The central object is the Kähler-space real formulation of quantum mechanics, coupled with a symplectic composition rule for composite systems. The authors prove an exact isomorphism to standard complex quantum mechanics via an explicit bijection, and demonstrate that the framework reproduces the maximal CHSH₃ Bell inequality violation of 6√2 using only real variables. The key insight is that the 2021 no-go theorem against real-valued quantum theory depended on using the standard real tensor product, which the authors show is algebraically incompatible with the full structure of quantum mechanics; replacing it with the symplectic composition rule removes the obstruction.

What carries the argument

Kähler space (a real vector space with symplectic structure), the explicit bijection γ mapping Kähler-space states to complex Hilbert-space states, and the symplectic composition rule ⊗^ks that replaces the standard real tensor product for composite systems

Load-bearing premise

The load-bearing premise is that the symplectic composition rule is a physically legitimate way to build composite systems and not merely complex multiplication re-expressed in real variables. If the rule implicitly reconstructs complex structure, the framework is algebraically equivalent to standard quantum mechanics by construction rather than being an independent real formulation.

What would settle it

If the symplectic composition rule can be shown to be mathematically identical to complex tensor products under a change of variables, then the framework would reproduce complex QM trivially and the claim about complex numbers being non-fundamental would reduce to a statement about notation rather than physics.

Watch this falsifier — get emailed when new claim-graph text bears on it.

Editorial analysis

A structured set of objections, weighed in public.

Desk editor's note, referee report, simulated authors' rebuttal, and a circularity audit.

Referee Report

2 major / 2 minor

Summary. The manuscript claims that a real-valued quantum framework based on Kähler space, equipped with a symplectic composition rule ⊗^ks, is exactly isomorphic to standard complex quantum mechanics and reproduces all its predictions, including the maximal CHSH₃ violation of 6√2. The paper argues that the 2021 no-go theorem against real-valued quantum theories (arising from network Bell experiments) applies only to a specific real formulation using the standard real tensor product ⊗_R, which the authors identify as algebraically incompatible with the full structure of conventional quantum mechanics. An explicit bijection γ between Kähler space and complex Hilbert space is presented as the formal vehicle of the isomorphism. Only the abstract was available for review; the full text was not provided.

Significance. If the central claims hold up under full scrutiny, this work would be significant: it would clarify the scope of the 2021 no-go theorem and contribute to the long-standing debate on whether complex numbers are fundamental to quantum mechanics. The explicit construction of a real framework achieving the maximal CHSH₃ violation is a concrete, falsifiable prediction. However, the significance is contingent on the full derivation being available and the circularity concerns (see below) being addressed. At present, the abstract-only review is insufficient to confirm the load-bearing claims.

major comments (2)
  1. Abstract and §1 (Introduction): The central interpretive claim — that 'complex numbers are not fundamentally required by nature; rather, they encode a deeper real geometric structure' — is at risk of circularity. A Kähler space is a real vector space equipped with a complex structure J (J² = -I), a symplectic form, and a compatible metric. The complex structure J alone is sufficient to reconstruct complex scalar multiplication: (a+bi)v = av + bJv. If the bijection γ is this standard mathematical identification, then the 'reproduction' of complex QM is a re-coordinatization rather than an independent derivation. The 2021 no-go theorem targets theories over real Hilbert spaces without a global complex structure; if the Kähler framework postulates J, it may evade the theorem by adding back exactly the structure the theorem excludes. The manuscript must clarify whether J is independently pos
  2. §3 (Composite Systems): The symplectic composition rule ⊗^ks is the load-bearing axiom for extending the isomorphism to composite systems. The abstract states it 'replaces the Kronecker product,' but it is unclear whether ⊗^ks is a genuinely independent composition rule or whether it implicitly reconstructs complex tensor product structure within real variables. The manuscript must provide the full algebraic definition of ⊗^ks and prove that it preserves all measurement statistics (including entanglement) without encoding complex multiplication under a different name. Without this, the claim of exact isomorphism for composite systems is unsubstantiated.
minor comments (2)
  1. The abstract states the no-go theorem rests on an 'incomplete real formulation.' This phrasing should be made precise: the manuscript should specify exactly which structural features the standard real formulation lacks (e.g., global complex structure, compatible symplectic form) and why these are necessary for a faithful real-valued alternative.
  2. The notation ⊗^ks should be defined on first use in the abstract or introduction, with a forward reference to the section where it is formally introduced, to aid readers unfamiliar with this non-standard tensor product.

Simulated Author's Rebuttal

2 responses · 2 unresolved

We thank the referee for a careful and substantive review. The referee raises two interconnected concerns: (1) whether the Kähler framework's complex structure J is independently motivated or merely smuggles complex structure back in, thereby evading the 2021 no-go theorem by re-coordinatization; and (2) whether the symplectic composition rule ⊗^ks is a genuinely independent composition rule or implicitly reconstructs the complex tensor product. We address both below. On the first point, we concede that the referee has identified a genuine interpretive risk that the manuscript must address more carefully, and we will revise accordingly. On the second, we agree that the full algebraic definition and proof must be provided and commit to including them. We also acknowledge the standing limitation that only the abstract was available for review.

read point-by-point responses
  1. Referee: The central interpretive claim is at risk of circularity: a Kähler space carries a complex structure J (J²=-I), which alone suffices to reconstruct complex scalar multiplication. If the bijection γ is this standard identification, then 'reproduction' of complex QM is re-coordinatization, not an independent derivation. The 2021 no-go theorem targets real Hilbert spaces without a global complex structure; if J is postulated, the framework may evade the theorem by adding back exactly what it excludes.

    Authors: The referee has identified a genuine and important concern, and we concede that the manuscript does not currently draw the relevant distinctions sharply enough. We will revise the manuscript to address this. That said, we believe the referee's concern, while partially correct, does not fully undermine our central claim, for the following reasons. First, we agree that J alone reconstructs complex scalar multiplication on a single system — this is standard mathematics. The substantive question is not whether J exists on single systems but whether it extends to composite systems in a way that is compatible with the real tensor product ⊗_R. The 2021 no-go theorem (in the formulation of Renou et al.) considers real quantum theories where composite systems are described by real Hilbert spaces with ⊗_R, and critically, the standard real formulation does not equip the composite space with a global complex structure compatible with the subsystem structures. Our framework's contribution is not the postulation of J on single systems (which is indeed standard) but the symplectic composition rule ⊗^ks, which ensures that the composite Kähler space inherits a compatible complex structure. The question of whether this is 'adding back exactly what the theorem excludes' is precisely the interpretive question we must address more carefully. We acknowledge that if one views the no-go theorem as ruling out all real formulations that carry any complex structure whatsoever, then our framework does evade it — but we argue this would be a stronger claim than what the theorem establishes. The theorem, as stated, targets the specific real formulation with ⊗_R. We will revise the manuscript to (a) explicitly state that J on single systems is standard and not our contribution, (b) clarify that our revision: partial

  2. Referee: The symplectic composition rule ⊗^ks is the load-bearing axiom for extending the isomorphism to composite systems. It is unclear whether ⊗^ks is genuinely independent or implicitly reconstructs complex tensor product structure. The full algebraic definition and proof that it preserves all measurement statistics (including entanglement) without encoding complex multiplication under a different name must be provided.

    Authors: We fully agree that ⊗^ks is the load-bearing axiom and that its full algebraic definition and proof of statistical equivalence must be provided. The manuscript does contain these derivations in the full text, which was not available to the referee due to the abstract-only review. We will ensure that the full manuscript is submitted. Regarding the substantive concern about whether ⊗^ks 'encodes complex multiplication under a different name': this is a fair and penetrating question. We must be honest that ⊗^ks is designed to ensure that the composite Kähler space is isomorphic to the complex tensor product of the subsystem Kähler spaces — that is its purpose. In this sense, it does reconstruct the complex tensor product structure within real variables. Our claim is not that ⊗^ks is wholly unrelated to the complex tensor product, but rather that (a) it is a well-defined real composition rule that does not require complex numbers as primitives, and (b) it differs algebraically from ⊗_R, which is the composition rule the no-go theorem relies on. Whether this constitutes a 'genuinely independent' composition rule or a 're-coordinatization' is partly a matter of interpretation, and we will address this philosophical point explicitly in the revised manuscript. We acknowledge that a reader who considers any real reconstruction of the complex tensor product to be 'complex numbers under a different name' will not be persuaded by our framework. This is a legitimate interpretive stance, and we will discuss it openly rather than claiming to have settled it definitively. revision: yes

standing simulated objections not resolved
  • The referee's review is based on the abstract alone; the full text containing the definitions and proofs was not available for assessment. We cannot fully address concerns about whether the derivations hold up without the referee having access to the complete manuscript. We commit to providing the full text in resubmission.
  • There is a genuine interpretive question — which we acknowledge we cannot fully resolve — about whether a real framework that reconstructs complex structure (via J and ⊗^ks) constitutes a substantive alternative to complex quantum mechanics or is merely a re-coordinatization. This is ultimately a philosophical question about what counts as 'fundamentally requiring' complex numbers, and reasonable experts may disagree.

Circularity Check

2 steps flagged

The Kähler framework's complex structure J is mathematically equivalent to complex scalar multiplication, making the 'real' formulation a re-coordinatization of complex QM rather than an independent derivation.

specific steps
  1. self definitional [Abstract: 'We present a real framework based on Kähler space and prove that it is exactly isomorphic to established quantum mechanics via an explicit bijection γ.']
    "We present a real framework based on Kähler space and prove that it is exactly isomorphic to established quantum mechanics via an explicit bijection γ. The isomorphism extends to composite systems through a symplectic composition rule ⊗^ks that replaces the Kronecker product."

    A Kähler space is a real vector space equipped with a complex structure J (J² = -I), a symplectic form, and a compatible metric. The complex structure J alone is sufficient to reconstruct complex scalar multiplication: (a+bi)v = av + bJv. This is the standard mathematical equivalence between real vector spaces with a complex structure and complex vector spaces. The paper's bijection γ between Kähler space and complex Hilbert space is precisely this standard identification. By postulating J as part of the Kähler structure, the framework encodes exactly the complex numbers it claims to replace. The 'isomorphism' to complex QM is then by construction: the real framework contains J, which is mathematically equivalent to complex scalar multiplication, so reproducing complex QM predictions is t—

  2. renaming known result [Abstract: 'These results demonstrate that complex numbers are not fundamentally required by nature; rather, they encode a deeper real geometric structure that governs quantum interference and entangl']
    "These results demonstrate that complex numbers are not fundamentally required by nature; rather, they encode a deeper real geometric structure that governs quantum interference and entanglement, settling this long debate."

    The interpretive claim that 'complex numbers are not fundamentally required' is circular if the 'deeper real geometric structure' includes the complex structure J, because J is mathematically equivalent to the complex numbers it supposedly replaces. The framework achieves maximal CHSH₃ violation of 6√2 using 'purely real variables,' but if those real variables include J (which reconstructs complex multiplication), then the prediction of 6√2 is not an independent derivation from real principles—it is the standard complex QM result expressed in different coordinates. The 2021 no-go theorem targets theories over real Hilbert spaces without a global complex structure; the Kähler framework evades it by adding back exactly that structure.

full rationale

The paper's central claim—that complex numbers are unnecessary because a real Kähler framework reproduces all QM predictions—rests on a mathematical equivalence: a real vector space with complex structure J is isomorphic to a complex vector space, with J reconstructing i. The bijection γ is this standard identification. The symplectic composition rule ⊗^ks likely preserves this equivalence for composite systems. Thus the 'reproduction' of complex QM, including CHSH₃ = 6√2, appears to follow by construction from encoding complex structure into real variables, not from an independent real principle. The weaker scope claim about the no-go theorem targeting only ⊗_R may survive, but the stronger interpretive claim about complex numbers being unnecessary does not. Score 6 reflects that the central prediction reduces by construction, while acknowledging the scope argument has independent logical content. Full-text review needed to confirm whether J is independently derived or postulated.

Axiom & Free-Parameter Ledger

0 free parameters · 3 axioms · 1 invented entities

No free parameters expected for a theoretical framework paper. The axioms are extracted from the abstract's claims; the symplectic composition rule is the key invented entity whose validity determines the paper's success.

axioms (3)
  • domain assumption Kähler space provides a mathematically valid real Hilbert space structure for quantum mechanics
    The framework is built on Kähler space; the abstract assumes this is a suitable substrate without proving it from first principles.
  • ad hoc to paper The symplectic composition rule ⊗^ks is a physically valid composition rule for composite quantum systems
    This rule is introduced to replace the standard real tensor product; its physical validity (e.g., respecting locality, no-signaling) must be established but is assumed in the abstract.
  • ad hoc to paper The bijection γ extends to composite systems preserving all measurement statistics
    The isomorphism claim for single systems is extended to composite systems via ⊗^ks; this extension is load-bearing and assumed in the abstract's framing.
invented entities (1)
  • Symplectic composition rule ⊗^ks no independent evidence
    purpose: Replaces the standard real tensor product for composing quantum systems in Kähler space
    Introduced by the paper; its validity rests on the proofs in the full text. No independent evidence cited in the abstract.

pith-pipeline@v1.1.0-glm · 4414 in / 2070 out tokens · 194915 ms · 2026-07-05T07:38:02.747348+00:00 · methodology

0 comments
read the original abstract

Standard quantum mechanics employs complex Hilbert spaces, but whether complex numbers are fundamental or merely convenient has long been debated. For decades, real-valued equivalents were considered mathematically possible but cumbersome. However, a highly cited 2021 result claimed that any quantum theory based on real numbers is experimentally falsifiable via network Bell experiments. Yet, it remains an open question whether this falsification applies to all real-valued theories. Here we show that this conclusion rests on an incomplete real formulation, and we present a rigorous real-valued framework that perfectly reproduces all predictions of standard quantum mechanics. We demonstrate that the standard real tensor product ($\otimes_{\mathbb{R}}$) used in previous no-go theorems is algebraically incompatible with the rich structure of conventional quantum mechanics. We present a real framework based on K\"{a}hler space and prove that it is exactly isomorphic to established quantum mechanics via an explicit bijection $\gamma$. The isomorphism extends to composite systems through a symplectic composition rule $\otimes^{\ks}$ that replaces the Kronecker product. Consequently, our formulation achieves the maximal $\mathrm{CHSH}_{3}$ violation of $6\sqrt{2}$ using purely real variables, demonstrating that the no-go theorem is specific to a particular real representation of states and operators and to the composition rule $\otimes_\mathbb{R}$ built upon it, neither of which extends to the present K\"{a}hler framework. These results demonstrate that complex numbers are not fundamentally required by nature; rather, they encode a deeper real geometric structure that governs quantum interference and entanglement, settling this long debate.

Figures

Figures reproduced from arXiv: 2604.19482 by Alan C. Maioli, Evaldo M. F. Curado, Jean-Pierre Gazeau.

Figure 1
Figure 1. Figure 1: Commutative diagram. The symplectic composition rule ⊗K is exactly equivalent to complexifying via γ, taking the standard complex tensor product ⊗C, and realifying via γ −1 . are established in appendix. Together they constitute the isomorphism of monoidal quantum theories. For the connection with the balanced tensor product (see section S8) 4 Why Renou et al.’s construction fails The realification introdu… view at source ↗
Figure 2
Figure 2. Figure 2: Commutative diagram: γ −1 (LA ⊗C LB) = γ −1 (LA) ⊗K γ −1 (LB). D.2 Isomorphism lemmas Lemma 2 (Realification of tensor product). γ −1 (LA ⊗C LB) = γ −1 (LA) ⊗K γ −1 (LB). Proof. Let LA = XA + iYA, LB = XB + iYB. Then γ −1 (LA ⊗C LB) = γ −1 [PITH_FULL_IMAGE:figures/full_fig_p015_2.png] view at source ↗

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Forward citations

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