REVIEW 2 major objections 5 minor 123 references
Spectroscopic classification of 251k LoTSS radio sources shows LERGs accrete below 1% of Eddington and HERGs above it.
Reviewed by Pith at T0; open to challenge. T0 means a machine referee read the full paper against a public rubric. the ladder, T0–T4 →
T0 review · grok-4.5
2026-07-10 17:26 UTC pith:D7TA5NNA
load-bearing objection Largest high-confidence spectroscopic radio catalogue to date; LERG/HERG accretion split reconfirmed cleanly, with the known [OIII] bolometric-correction caveat already flagged by the authors. the 2 major comments →
The DESI View of the Faint Radio Source Population in LoTSS DR2
The pith
A machine-rendered reading of the paper's core claim, the machinery that carries it, and where it could break.
Core claim
When radio-excess, BPT, modified MEx and [OIII] equivalent-width diagnostics are combined with Monte-Carlo error propagation on DESI spectra, LERGs and HERGs remain cleanly separated in Eddington-scaled accretion rate out to z~1, with LERGs peaking below 1% Eddington and HERGs above it; a minority high-accreting LERG subpopulation nevertheless displays star-forming spectral features that complicate the interpretation of their accretion rates.
What carries the argument
A hierarchical probabilistic classifier that first applies radio-excess plus BPT (or modified MEx at higher z), then recovers additional weak-lined LERGs with EW[OIII]<3 Å, all inside 1,000 Monte-Carlo realisations that propagate flux, mass and aperture uncertainties into class probabilities.
Load-bearing premise
The conversion of [OIII] luminosity into bolometric luminosity (and thence Eddington ratio) is assumed to be reliable for both LERGs and HERGs even though the paper notes the correction is less secure for LERGs and can be inflated by star formation.
What would settle it
X-ray or mid-infrared bolometric luminosities independent of [OIII] that place the high-accreting LERG tail firmly below 1% Eddington would falsify the claim that those objects are genuinely high-accretion systems rather than star-formation-contaminated LERGs.
Editorial analysis
A structured set of objections, weighed in public.
Referee Report
Summary. The paper presents a probabilistic spectroscopic classification of 251,413 LoTSS DR2 radio sources cross-matched with DESI DR1 spectra. Combining a radio-excess diagnostic (re-derived L_Hα–L_144 relation), BPT and modified MEx diagrams, and an EW[OIII] cut, with Monte Carlo propagation of flux and mass uncertainties, the authors produce class probabilities for SFGs, RQ AGN, LERGs and HERGs. At a 90% probability threshold they report 68,820 SFGs, 32,288 RQ AGN, 35,210 LERGs and 3,085 HERGs—the largest high-confidence spectroscopic radio sample to date. They then show that LERGs and HERGs occupy distinct Eddington-scaled accretion-rate distributions (typically below and above ~1% of Eddington, respectively) and identify a minority high-λ_Edd LERG tail whose stacked spectra exhibit star-forming features.
Significance. If the classifications and accretion-rate dichotomy hold, the work supplies the largest spectroscopically classified faint-radio catalogue available and a clear foundation for SKA-era demographic studies. Strengths include transparent Monte Carlo treatment of negative fluxes and warning flags, hierarchical use of multiple diagnostics, explicit quantification of DESI selection (BGS vs LRG), and a direct ~95% agreement check against the Drake et al. SDSS classifications on jointly classified sources. The catalogue and stacked spectra will be of immediate community value.
major comments (2)
- Section 6.1 and the strongest claim rest on λ_Edd = log10[(L_bol + L_mech)/L_Edd] with L_bol = 3500 L_[OIII] (Heckman et al. 2004) and the Häring & Rix (2004) M_BH–M_* relation applied uniformly. The manuscript itself notes that the [OIII] bolometric correction is less reliable for LERGs and that high-λ_Edd LERGs show star-forming features that can inflate L_[OIII] (Sections 6.1, 6.3; stacked spectra in Fig. 11 and BPT locations in Fig. 12). The dichotomy remains visible even when L_mech is omitted, and EW-selected LERGs are correctly treated as upper limits, but the paper should quantify how much the high-λ_Edd LERG tail shrinks under plausible alternative bolometric corrections or X-ray priors, or else state more explicitly that the absolute scale of λ_Edd for LERGs is model-dependent while the relative separation is robust.
- Section 4.1: dust-corrected Hα luminosities for the high-z sample (and for low-S/N low-z sources) are assigned from UVJ-binned A_V medians measured on the low-z Balmer-decrement sample. The authors validate the trend only qualitatively with stacked Hγ/Hβ and note that ~10% of sources fall outside the bins. Because the radio-excess cut (Eq. 3) and therefore the LERG/HERG split depend on this A_V assignment, a quantitative residual comparison (or a sensitivity test that varies the UVJ A_V by its 16–84 percentile width) is needed to show that the high-z LERG/HERG numbers and the accretion-rate distributions are not driven by the UVJ mapping.
minor comments (5)
- Table 2 and Section 4.4: the large unclassified fraction (79,314 at 90%) is expected given the conservative threshold, but a short statement of how many of these become classifiable at 70% (already given in the text) would help readers decide which threshold to adopt for their science.
- Figure 1 right panel and Section 5.2: the DESI selection effects (BGS vs LRG) are well quantified; a brief note that WEAVE-LOFAR will remove the optical bias would strengthen the forward-looking claim in the conclusions.
- Section 3.4: the Type-1 flag (FWHM_Hβ > FWHM_[OIII] in ≥99% of realisations and FWHM_Hβ > 1000 km s−1) is sensible; a one-sentence comparison of the recovered Type-1 fraction with literature DESI or SDSS Type-1 rates would reassure readers that the cut is not overly aggressive.
- Equation (3) and the accompanying text: the radio-excess offset is given as 15.00(±0.02); stating whether this uncertainty is propagated into the Monte Carlo realisations (or only the line fluxes and masses) would clarify the final probability uncertainties.
- Minor typographical issues: occasional missing spaces around units and a few long sentences in Sections 4.4 and 6.1 that could be split for readability.
Circularity Check
No significant circularity: classification diagnostics and Eddington-ratio scalings are external literature relations applied to new DESI+LoTSS data; self-citations supply methods only.
specific steps
-
self citation load bearing
[Section 4.2 / Eq. (4) and Section 1]
"the modified version incorporates a redshift-dependent offset … defined as: log10 M = log10 M−[1−exp(−1.2z)]. … by adopting the method introduced by A25, in which a modified Mass–Excitation (MEx) diagram is used"
The redshift-dependent MEx offset and the hierarchical probabilistic scheme are taken from the authors' own prior paper (A25). This is a methodological self-citation, not a uniqueness claim that forces the LERG/HERG dichotomy or the sample sizes; the offset is an empirical correction for mass–metallicity evolution already discussed in external literature (Henry et al. 2021; Cleri et al. 2023). It does not make the final classifications tautological.
full rationale
The paper's central results (sample sizes at >90% probability and the LERG/HERG λ_Edd dichotomy) are obtained by applying well-known external demarcation lines (Kauffmann et al. 2003b, Cid Fernandes et al. 2010, Juneau et al. 2014, Laing et al. 1994) and scaling relations (Heckman et al. 2004 L_bol=3500 L_[OIII], Häring & Rix 2004 M_BH–M_*, Cavagnolo et al. 2010 L_mech) to a new spectroscopic sample. The radio-excess threshold is re-derived as a 99th-percentile cut on the present data, which is a standard empirical procedure rather than a free parameter tuned to force the final claim. Self-citations to A25 and Dr24 provide the hierarchical Monte-Carlo framework and the modified MEx offset, but those works themselves rest on the same external diagnostics; they do not supply the target numerical results. The high-accreting LERG tail is reported as an observational finding with explicit caveats (upper limits, possible SF contamination of [OIII]), not as a prediction derived from the classification inputs. No equation reduces by construction to its own fitted input, and no uniqueness theorem is imported to forbid alternatives. Score 1 reflects only the minor, non-load-bearing self-citation of method papers by overlapping authors.
Axiom & Free-Parameter Ledger
free parameters (4)
- radio-excess demarcation offset =
15.00 ± 0.02
- L_bol / L_[OIII] conversion factor =
3500
- EW_[OIII] LERG/HERG cut =
3 Å
- probability threshold for high-confidence sample =
0.90
axioms (4)
- domain assumption The Kauffmann et al. (2003b) and Cid Fernandes et al. (2010) lines on the BPT diagram cleanly separate SFGs, RQ AGN, LERGs and HERGs.
- domain assumption L_bol = 3500 L_[OIII] and the Häring & Rix M_BH–M_* relation yield usable Eddington ratios for both accretion modes.
- ad hoc to paper UVJ colours can be used to assign A_V (and therefore dust-corrected Hα) for the high-z sample where Balmer decrement is unavailable.
- domain assumption Spectral index α = −0.7 for converting 144 MHz to 1.4 GHz luminosities.
read the original abstract
The faint radio-source population includes galaxies dominated by both star formation (SF) and active galactic nuclei (AGN), which are two key processes shaping galaxy evolution. To investigate this population, we probabilistically classified 251,413 radio sources from the second data release of the LOFAR Two-metre Sky Survey (LoTSS DR2) using spectroscopic data from the first release of the Dark Energy Spectroscopic Instrument (DESI DR1). Our classification method includes: (i) the identification of radio excess relative to SF, (ii) the Baldwin, Philips & Terlevich (BPT) diagram, (iii) a modified Mass Excitation (MEx) diagram, and (iv) the [OIII]5007 equivalent width. These are combined with Monte Carlo methods to estimate the probability that each source is a star-forming galaxy (SFG), a radio-quiet AGN (RQ AGN), or a low- or high-excitation radio galaxy (LERG or HERG), allowing various thresholds to be applied depending on science goals. Considering classifications above a 90 per cent probability threshold, we identify 68,820 SFGs, 32,288 RQ AGN, 35,210 LERGs and 3,085 HERGs, representing the largest radio sample to date with high-confidence spectroscopic classifications. Using this sample, we show with higher statistical power than previous studies that LERGs typically accrete below 1 per cent of the Eddington limit and HERGs above it. We also identify a small subset of high-accreting LERGs whose stacked spectra reveal prominent star-forming features, highlighting difficulties in interpreting their accretion properties. Our results demonstrate the power of large spectroscopic samples to characterise the radio-source population, providing a foundation for studies in the SKA era.
Figures
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The WEAVE-LOFAR Survey. SF2A-2016: Proceedings of the Annual meeting of the French Society of Astronomy and Astrophysics , year = 2016, editor =. doi:10.48550/arXiv.1611.02706 , archivePrefix =. 1611.02706 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.48550/arxiv.1611.02706 2016
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[61]
The Origin of the Mass--Metallicity Relation: Insights from 53,000 Star-Forming Galaxies in the SDSS
The Origin of the Mass-Metallicity Relation: Insights from 53,000 Star-forming Galaxies in the Sloan Digital Sky Survey. , keywords =. doi:10.1086/423264 , archivePrefix =. astro-ph/0405537 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1086/423264
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[62]
The LOFAR Two-metre Sky Survey. III. First data release: Optical/infrared identifications and value-added catalogue. , keywords =. doi:10.1051/0004-6361/201833564 , archivePrefix =. 1811.07927 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1051/0004-6361/201833564
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[63]
emcee: The MCMC Hammer. , keywords =. doi:10.1086/670067 , archivePrefix =. 1202.3665 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1086/670067
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[64]
Exploring the radio-loudness of SDSS quasars with spectral stacking
Exploring the radio loudness of SDSS quasars with spectral stacking. , keywords =. doi:10.1093/mnras/stae233 , archivePrefix =. 2401.08774 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1093/mnras/stae233
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[65]
The infrared-radio correlation of star-forming galaxies is strongly M _ -dependent but nearly redshift-invariant since z 4. , keywords =. doi:10.1051/0004-6361/202039647 , archivePrefix =. 2010.05510 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1051/0004-6361/202039647 2010
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[66]
The LoTSS view of radio AGN in the local Universe. The most massive galaxies are always switched on
The LoTSS view of radio AGN in the local Universe. The most massive galaxies are always switched on. , keywords =. doi:10.1051/0004-6361/201833883 , archivePrefix =. 1811.05528 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1051/0004-6361/201833883
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[67]
Electron densities from [S II] lines significantly overestimate the impact of ionized AGN outflows. , keywords =. doi:10.1093/mnras/staf2075 , archivePrefix =. 2511.15791 , primaryClass =
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[68]
The LOFAR Two-metre Sky Survey: VII. Third Data Release. arXiv e-prints , keywords =
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[69]
On the Black Hole Mass - Bulge Mass Relation
On the Black Hole Mass-Bulge Mass Relation. , keywords =. doi:10.1086/383567 , archivePrefix =. astro-ph/0402376 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1086/383567
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[70]
Black Holes at the Centers of Nearby Dwarf Galaxies
Black Holes At the Centers of Nearby Dwarf Galaxies. , keywords =. doi:10.1088/0004-6256/148/6/136 , archivePrefix =. 1408.4451 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1088/0004-6256/148/6/136
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[71]
The nature of compact radio-loud AGN: a systematic look at the LOFAR AGN population
The nature of compact radio-loud AGN: a systematic look at the LOFAR AGN population. , keywords =. doi:10.1093/mnras/stae658 , archivePrefix =. 2402.19424 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1093/mnras/stae658
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[72]
MIGHTEE: A first look at MIGHTEE quasars
MIGHTEE: A first look at MIGHTEE quasars. , keywords =. doi:10.1093/mnras/staf1187 , archivePrefix =. 2507.12046 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1093/mnras/staf1187
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[73]
LoTSS/HETDEX: Optical quasars. I. Low-frequency radio properties of optically selected quasars. , keywords =. doi:10.1051/0004-6361/201833892 , archivePrefix =. 1811.07933 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1051/0004-6361/201833892
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[74]
All-purpose, all-sky photometric redshifts for the Legacy Imaging Surveys Data Release 8
All-purpose, all-sky photometric redshifts for the Legacy Imaging Surveys Data Release 8. , keywords =. doi:10.1093/mnras/stac608 , archivePrefix =. 2203.01949 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1093/mnras/stac608
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[75]
The mass evolution of the first galaxies: stellar mass functions and star formation rates at 4 < z < 7 in the CANDELS GOODS-South field. , keywords =. doi:10.1093/mnras/stu1622 , archivePrefix =. 1408.2527 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1093/mnras/stu1622
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[76]
The Wide-field Infrared Survey Explorer (WISE): Mission Description and Initial On-orbit Performance
The Wide-field Infrared Survey Explorer (WISE): Mission Description and Initial On-orbit Performance. , keywords =. doi:10.1088/0004-6256/140/6/1868 , archivePrefix =. 1008.0031 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1088/0004-6256/140/6/1868
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[77]
Observational Constraints on the Merger History of Galaxies since z 6: Probabilistic Galaxy Pair Counts in the CANDELS Fields. , keywords =. doi:10.3847/1538-4357/ab148a , archivePrefix =. 1903.12188 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.3847/1538-4357/ab148a 1903
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[78]
Project Overview of the Beijing-Arizona Sky Survey
Project Overview of the Beijing-Arizona Sky Survey. , keywords =. doi:10.1088/1538-3873/aa65ba , archivePrefix =. 1702.03653 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.1088/1538-3873/aa65ba
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[79]
Overview of the DESI Milky Way Survey
Overview of the DESI Milky Way Survey. , keywords =. doi:10.3847/1538-4357/acb3c0 , archivePrefix =. 2208.08514 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.3847/1538-4357/acb3c0
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[80]
Preliminary Target Selection for the DESI Bright Galaxy Survey (BGS)
Preliminary Target Selection for the DESI Bright Galaxy Survey (BGS). Research Notes of the American Astronomical Society , keywords =. doi:10.3847/2515-5172/abc25a , archivePrefix =. 2010.11283 , primaryClass =
work page internal anchor Pith review Pith/arXiv arXiv doi:10.3847/2515-5172/abc25a 2010
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